Jonse wrote:

Solid wrote:

7 Everybody's Lonesome - Luigi Bianchi

Ok, this needs work, but it’s not all bad. I didn’t get it at all when I first listened to it, but this was before I had the lyric in front of me. Much better then.
One other thing. You seem pretty keen on revisiting this, as though to “put it right”. Apart from the obvious (lead vocals too low in the mix), what are you thinking of doing?

Exactly that me ode cheese. Wont be til next week though. Ive tried just making the "backing track" (all loops) quieter, but then its out of balance. Ill re-post a link so that people can download just no.7 and add it if you all so wish.

Ill have to do a review in the little time away from work i have!

I'm not an expert, but turning things up and down is not the only option available. Panning the vocals centre, and distributing the backing elsewhere in the stereo mix could possibly bring the lead voc forward. Forgive me if I'm teaching your grandma to suck eggs, but do you have the facility to take this approach?

Solid wrote:

Jonse wrote:

Solid wrote:

7 Everybody's Lonesome - Luigi Bianchi

Ok, this needs work, but it’s not all bad. I didn’t get it at all when I first listened to it, but this was before I had the lyric in front of me. Much better then.
One other thing. You seem pretty keen on revisiting this, as though to “put it right”. Apart from the obvious (lead vocals too low in the mix), what are you thinking of doing?

Exactly that me ode cheese. Wont be til next week though. Ive tried just making the "backing track" (all loops) quieter, but then its out of balance. Ill re-post a link so that people can download just no.7 and add it if you all so wish.

Ill have to do a review in the little time away from work i have!

I'm not an expert, but turning things up and down is not the only option available. Panning the vocals centre, and distributing the backing elsewhere in the stereo mix could possibly bring the lead voc forward. Forgive me if I'm teaching your grandma to suck eggs, but do you have the facility to take this approach?

The use of filters is also a good thing to try, think about the different instruments and the frequencies that make up them. I had a big issue in PRAG 5 where I had a hammond organ and a bass guitar riff that basically clashed over the same frequency range and it made the bass guitar sound out of tune. So I had to use different filters to give each instrument its own frequency range so that I could play them in the same track, its a compromise in terms of how the instruments sound but hopefully you could get them to sit together. Another trick that you can play to bring the instrument back out again in the mix is to create in a Low Frequency Oscilator (LFO) on to say your filter breakpoint. Especially if the have a higher order frequency filter which will then pick out frequencies as it moves around. So you can then create a frequency space for each instruments and then bring them back out again by generating some movement in the instrument.

Also it terms of volume the thing that normally kills you is the low end frequencies so another good thing to do is put a high pass filter set to 50Hz at the end of all your tracks. (Unless you want a really deep note). Some Fx's especially reverbs can end up generating some low frequencies that weren't there in the original instrument and which kill you later on.

.... I'll get my coat

Modified once, last modified by DrumAliens on Thu 4th November, 2010 @ 11:32pm

DrumAliens wrote:

Solid wrote:

Jonse wrote:

Solid wrote:

7 Everybody's Lonesome - Luigi Bianchi

Ok, this needs work, but it’s not all bad. I didn’t get it at all when I first listened to it, but this was before I had the lyric in front of me. Much better then.
One other thing. You seem pretty keen on revisiting this, as though to “put it right”. Apart from the obvious (lead vocals too low in the mix), what are you thinking of doing?

Exactly that me ode cheese. Wont be til next week though. Ive tried just making the "backing track" (all loops) quieter, but then its out of balance. Ill re-post a link so that people can download just no.7 and add it if you all so wish.

Ill have to do a review in the little time away from work i have!

I'm not an expert, but turning things up and down is not the only option available. Panning the vocals centre, and distributing the backing elsewhere in the stereo mix could possibly bring the lead voc forward. Forgive me if I'm teaching your grandma to suck eggs, but do you have the facility to take this approach?

The use of filters is also a good thing to try, think about the different instruments and the frequencies that make up them. I had a big issue in PRAG 5 where I had a hammond organ and a bass guitar riff that basically clashed over the same frequency range and it made the bass guitar sound out of tune. So I had to use different filters to give each instrument its own frequency range so that I could play them in the same track, its a compromise in terms of how the instruments sound but hopefully you could get them to sit together. Another trick that you can play to bring the instrument back out again in the mix is to create in a Low Frequency Oscilator (LFO) on to say your filter breakpoint. Especially if the have a higher order frequency filter which will then pick out frequencies as it moves around. So you can then create a frequency space for each instruments and then bring them back out again by generating some movement in the instrument.

Also it terms of volume the thing that normally kills you is the low end frequencies so another good thing to do is put a high pass filter set to 50Hz at the end of all your tracks. (Unless you want a really deep note). Some Fx's especially reverbs can end up generating some low frequencies that weren't there in the original instrument and which kill you later on.

.... I'll get my coat

He's as sweet as a squirrels nut! =)

Yep, a 4 yr old.

red_riviera wrote:

PRAG is starting pay dividends for the participants, which is what the intention was all along. Anyone can go back and listen to the early PRAGs and see how individuals and the general standard has improved. I don't want to put off anyone who is just getting started with recording... just get stuck in to the next one and watch your skillz develop amongst a great atmosphere of support. I've been on a few songwriting projects on bigger forums, but PRAG has turned out to be the most enduring and far and away the most rewarding. You folks make it what it is and I'm truly humbled to be part of it. <hugs and >

r_r

Hear Hear. If it wasn't for PRAG I wouldn't have been able to spout on about filters and frequencies as I did in post 427.

I need to respond to all of the comments, which are appreciated, about my track and put my own comments up. I was going to do that last night when the kids were in bed and the wife was out but I fell asleep in front of the TV.

Will get on it over the weekend

Modified twice, last modified by DrumAliens on Fri 5th November, 2010 @ 6:33am

red_riviera wrote:

Statistical Abstract of The USA - Society Has The Teenagers It Deserves

Two lovely songs smashed together with big drums. Wonderfully consistent mood throughout, wistful yet hopeful. Great stream-of-consciousness lyrics. The only thing that irks me are the Americanisms of "highway" and "sidewalk" that jar with uncaringly regional accent ("saniteh"). 7/10

I incorporated band name, song name and picture into my track plus i want to be american

Lovely comments thanks, everyone. I haven't sat down and done a track-by-track yet but I'm still listening to the songs whenever I can, which surely says something! In full agreement with red's sentiments above and I'd like to say a huge thanks to him, once again!

I have been totally slack and not gotten my arse in gear to listen to this - I will fo sho provide my thoughts on the collective songs.

Red was right about my guitars actually not being too heavily distorted - I kept that to an almost classic rock sound and just fiddled with a few layers - i REALLY like the sound that came out fwiw and its a testament to the idea of less is more. certainly sounds more cutting and less "slab o' fudge"

also - Prag is def one of the best thing about pieknapper community and long may it continue!

I'm being moaned at in the office because, apparently, I keep singing the line "and take you to the horse dentist", over and over again.

I didn't even know I was doing it.

red_riviera wrote:

Masovian Voivodeship - And That's Your Own Self

The title / backing vox = HOOK! Look at the size of it! You could catch a mako shark with a hook that strong! Drum break didn't take me anywhere, nor did the guitar solo until it calmed down and then it became a very clever mood shift. Outro vocal could have used some work, but apart from these niggles this is a lovely slice of well-buttered indie-pop. Belle & Sebastian, beware! 7/10

The Walsh wrote:

And That's Your Own Self
Starts off very OMD and goes a bit Vienna... awesome vocal hook. Love the guitar sound in the solo. Great stuff!

Sean C. S. wrote:

Masovian Voivodeship - I think it is like the kind of early 90s sound - the drum beat and guitar riff and everything. Stone Roses or something? Anyway it's pretty cool, nice melodies. Also the drums sound sweet when the other instruments back off, that's an effective thing for me. An unexpected guitar solo! I like guitar solos. This one is quite Noel Gallagherish I think. I suppose a criticism might be that the drum loop is the same throughout, but then again this creates an interesting effect throughout and like I said has a good effect when the other instruments are backed off.

^^Cheers for the comments^^

Solid wrote:

11 And That's Your Own Self - Masovian Voivodeship

I love the vocal hook. Bit rough around the edges, but I enjoy the overall listen.

That little bit of harmonica made me do a mini cum.

Cheers Solid - mini cum made me laugh, proper review that!

Been down to my brother's tonight.

He's 41, great bachelor set up; disposable income.

Good cinema / video / tv, excellent sound system and a seriously classy pool table.

Big fridge. Proper ashtrays.

We watched Masterind, Q.I. and Russell Howard.

We listened to PRAG 6.

Then we put Depehce Mode on.

For the rest of the night

Modified 4 times, last modified by Solid on Sat 6th November, 2010 @ 1:00am

With all due blessings from The Pope Of Prag; The Pragmeister and 50% of Distant Guns.

Now available to listen on line at . . .

Reverbnation - PRAG 6 : The Nature Of Chaos

Full Album Stream And Download

The Walsh wrote:

Cross Country Running

Again, vocals very low in the mix. Slightly depressing. VLC Player crashed halfway through...

Sean C. S. wrote:

Gbetogo - From the start I expected it to be a hip hop song for some reason. Good beats. The Joy Division style singing is cool alongside the organ. It's quite long I think, and I'm thinking this is the point, so a success on that front I expect. I think this was the song with the woman sitting as the picture. But in an unexpected twist, this wasn't included in the song in a manner similar to the first track. It is a good interpretation of the title I reckon.

jackbomb wrote:

CCR - Gbetogo

With a drum loop that'd suit JayZ, I'd like to buy that off'v you, observe your routine for a while, and then murder you in cold blood. I think this has potential, but it doesn't build or fall, and I find it a bit of a chore to listen to. I like everything that's there, but just not enough to hear it over and over and over with no real variation. However, I have had a bottle of wine, and I'm not exactly LosBenos when it comes to this sort of thing. The guitaring was great, as shown in the last bar.

Orin Scrivello (Darko) wrote:

10 Gbétogo - Cross Country Running - DrumAliens

Dj Shadow all over that beat, we need more organ in the world. Keen on the repetitive pickin and like when the backin vocals are there. 6/10

Solid wrote:

10 Cross Country Running – Gbétogo

I think this is quite a brave effort. Surprisingly epic piece of song writing set to a minimalist production. Cool beat.

red_riviera wrote:

Gbétogo - Cross Country Running

Again two songs here. Song 1: Devastating drum loop brilliantly offset by weedy acoustic plucks. I could easily listen to 3-4 minutes just of this, because it's like a lost scene from Ghost Dog: Way Of The Samurai. RZA are firmly in the hizz-ouse here. Song 2: Baritone vocal and overloud Hammond / Farfisa. Like the Inspiral Carpets when they went a bit dark and down-tempo and no-one bought their records, except me. Both songs are very good, but I am of the mind they just do not fit together. There is a major faultline all the way through that I just can't get over on this track... and it doesn't help that the whole thing could easily lose a minute. If it weren't for these arrangement issues, this would have been a contender for pick of the bunch. 7/10

Thanks for all the comments much appreciated

I went to 2 different Comprehensive Schools where they inflicted this type of punishment (Cross Country Running) over the winter months and both of them had hills near them that they would force us up on Thursday morning any day that it was a slightly rainy or muddy under foot. So I had this strong idea for the lyrics and because I had the Chorus idea from the start it was always going to be long and sail a thin line between success and boaring. I did manage to get quite a few different ideas in there but I appreciate that might not have been quite enough. Homework for PRAG 7. The use of the rain effect hopefully help set the scene without have to describe alot basically a time saver.

It could have been worse I had spent so much time on the lyrics and vocals that I didn't have any drums for it until Tuesday, and then there wasn't any variation it until Thursday. Friday I came up with the guitar bit which started of as a piano part I programmed in at Leicester Forest East Service station which seemed to help pull it all together. I decided on the guitar part because I could record it quickly and slow the whole thing down to a final chord as a way of ending the track. I had to put in a notch filter to get rid of the boom on the guitar which can't have helped on the weedy guitar stakes, I can hear the voices now about microphone placement. I ended up using a Church Organ effect because as I can't play piano chords (gettting there, just put three fingers down on the keys and then move till you find something in tune) I keep finding some big chords which filled up the space nicely. The drums were the easiest part 15mins to find a loop, 5mins to slice apply some Blockfish 'Fat Drum Loop' and CamelCrusher 'Ultra Phat' and there you are.

Overall I'm please with the result, the lyrics worked well and I finally managed to get a decent vocal recording which worked pretty much out of the box without any dick around with EQ thanks to my newly aquired Samson CO1U. I really love the guitar I keep think it won't fit it won't fit it shouldn't and I get to the end track and I'm suprise every time that it does.

Red do you want 3 minutes of the weedy guitar and drums ? If so is that with or without rain effect. Also this was the first PRAG when I have listened back to the mastered version I haven't though 'I'm sure it did sound like that' and raced back to the original to see what I did wrong. Am I getting better at this lark or are you sliping ????

What I really like about PRAG is the good grace in which compliments and constructive criticism is received. I lack such good grace for the most part, so I do actually admire it.

Actually this is something I've wondered about on occasion with my submissions.

On my mixer (Boss BR1600) - in order to burn the track to CD, which is how I get the track over to my computer, the machine makes you first bounce everything into one stereo track, then "master" that, which is to say when I go to the burn menu, the only tracks that show up are master tracks, not the bounces / mixdowns etc.

What I'm getting at is - in future would my tracks have better results if I found another way to get the music over to my computer? If I recall corectly you had a BR1600, so if you had any suggestions that'd be appreciated.

Everything that ever comes off that machine seems to me to sound a little... boxy, I'd call it. But listening to it on the laptop and not having the best ears for it, I just go with it. Cheers

red_riviera wrote:

As it says in the PRAG FAQs an uncompressed mix is always preferred at the point of submission.

Guilty as charged

Cheers

PRAG 6 review.

1. Please make this into a play. But do not expand it. Like the song, I want a the play to be 4.07 minutes long and cost £846 a ticket.

2. So, prisoners can vote. And there is nothing we can do about it. Except make this the music in their polling station, set at level 11, with stroke inducing strobe lighting in each booth.

3. You did it. Steam Trains! They smell great.

4. Should be the theme to a soap opera set in Hell. Where the cast spend every hour stabbing Louie Walsh with Simon Cowell's hair. He doesn't need his hair because he is in a cave being raped by an aids infected T-Rex. Fantastiche.

5. After years scowering the Earth for DNA of David Bowie, Morrissey and the surviving members of Joy Division, a hybrid is created. He escapes the lab to record this. Brilliant! My PRAG 6 favourite.

6. Brutally simplistic and deeply unsettling. The 2 qualities I have based my life on.

7. Social commentary on twats never gets boring. It's as though the scum/scally/chav/ned wrote it himself. If he was capable of removing his hand from his tracksuit bottoms to utilise a pen.

8. Excellently placed in the PRAG. A fantastic instrumental. It's like Doves went to Europa with a few pedals and a recorder.

9. The best title on the record. And the song does it justice. A wonderful groove which stopped me running over the 'characters' from track 7....For now.

10. This stopped me from going for a run. Made me light another cigarette. And crack open the Jim Beam. Danka.

11. Where you born in the Little Big Planet world? So dreamy. Magic.

12. A restrained, but blatently up front Psycho. Calm, well spoken...but bat shit feckin' crazy. I see Michael Douglas (in Falling Down), evolving into Andy Robinson (in Dirty Harry). He finds a vile of the 28 Days Later virus and serves it over ice.

13. What started as an attempt to do something 'chilled' or 'lounge' quickly descended into pedals set to kill. I could go into what gear i used and in what order, but I'd be lying if I said I remembered.

14. A superb PRAG ender. Swirley and yet calm. Folk music from the future.

Overall. Another fantastic PRAG, which sits very well as an album. Despite the varying styles and beverages downed during its production. 8.76 / 10

Great idea. I'm going to listen to it all AGAIN.

palmer_eldritch wrote:

Great idea. I'm going to listen to it all AGAIN.

Which has reminded me to bump this:

Reverbnation - PRAG 6 : The Nature Of Chaos

Full Album Stream And Download

Mr Deathray - I do thank thee kindly.